caferacermike Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 So I've been buying up a lot of bulk materials and decided it is time to automate my tank. After years of hauling buckets from the garage to the tank for make up water I've decided it is time for some fun. I kept telling myself I was going to tear the 75g down anytime and set up the 400g tank so let's not drill any holes from the garage to the 75g.. Well with the foundation growing and shrinking everyday due to the weather, and my neighbors foundation repair FAILURE, I've just given up on fixing the house. So for now I'm going to proceed with the 75g automation to test a few things before seeing about setting up the big tank, foundation repair or not. Looking for feed back from my plan if you've ever done all of this. I've obtained for myself, 1x 8g kit of bulk 2 part solution with MG add on kit from Bulk Reef. 1x 5g bucket of pure Kalk from BR 1x ATO peristaltic pump at 50ml per minute from BR 1x random electronic ATO float power interrupter switch 2x 1.6ml per minute ultra precise peristaltic doser from BR for dosing 2 part 1x 55g barrel with screw top lid, new plastic 3x 1g clear plastic jugs with screw on lids 6x 1/4" Guest Bulkheads 4x 20' of 1/4" tubing in various colors 1x Maxijet900 3x digital timers 1x 6 way power strip with GFCI and surge So here is the plan. I am moving my 125g RO water station back about a foot to make room for the 55g barrel to fit under it and next to my dryer. The tank is directly on the other side of the wall. Kalk: I will be filling the 55g barrel with clean RO/DI and Kalk powder at a ratio of 3 cups of powder to 55g of water. This closely relates to the chart on the BR website. To this I will be adding the Maxijet to stir the solution once a day. The Kalkwasser will be hooked directly to the 50ML per minute doser pump which will be controlled by the electronic float switch in the sump. The pump will be ran on a digital timer around 7:00pm everyday for about 2 hours so that it will be prevented from being allowed to accidentally overfill the main tank. The Maxijet will be on the same timer as the Alkalinity timer for the 2 part. As the Alkalinity flows into the tank, the maxijet will stir the kalk so that it has a few hours before being allowed into the main tank. 2 part solution: There will be 2 timers on them, one for each jug. The Alkalinity will dose around midnight and the Calcium will dose around noon. That way I will separate them by 12 hours and not dose them at the same time. It appears that each pump will need to run for about 45 minutes a day to maintain close to the 75ml needed per day for my 75g tank. I have not yet added a doser for the MG, I'm still trying to decide if it is worth it or not. I will need to begin a daily regimen of tracking the MG for at least 30 days to decide what, if any, action will need to take place. I have it in bulk so once a week top offs might be better. So: 1. At midnight the Alkalinity will run for about 3/4 of an hour dosing approximately 75ml of ALK to my tank while also commanding the MJ in the 55g barrel to stir my Kalkwasser for the same amount of time. 2. Around noon the CA will run for 3/4 of an hour dosing approximately 75ml of CA into my tank. 3. Around 7:00pm my timer for ATO will click on for approximately 2 hours. At around 50ml per minute 1 hour of time should give me about 1 3/4 gallons of top off water should I need it. My tank generally needs about 1.5g of water a day. The float switch should be sufficient to control the pump but the triple redundancy of having the float switch for precise delivery, the timer to allow only a small amount of run out should the float not work, and someone being home during those hours should the need arise to step in. The weakest link I see is the MJ rusting from the corrosive nature fo the Kalk. I can get them for cheap enough so I'm ok with that for now. If it proves bothersome I may attempt some sort of external mixer. Anyone care to comment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rgwiz11 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I'm sure if it got really bothersome, you could find 55g plastic drums. I've seen them floating around for $30-40 before. Otherwise, I've never automated anything before, so I'm no help as far as commenting goes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 26, 2009 Author Share Posted October 26, 2009 Got my 55g barrel/drum for $25 in Leander... I'm set, in fact I have extras if anyone wants one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Correct me if I am wrong but I thought that with Kalk you mixed it, skimmed off the top and made sure not to use what settled in the bottom? I have only used it a little, quite some time ago. I am just using 2 part daily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 Right, refer to original post. My Kalk will be stirred once daily for about an hour and then allowed to settle for 16 hours before use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb in Austin Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 As one with foundation issues also, who in Austin doesn't right?, care to elaborate on the failure remark. PM if you wish too, or make a new topic. I do understand that your info is 2nd or 3rd hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Right, refer to original post. My Kalk will be stirred once daily for about an hour and then allowed to settle for 16 hours before use. ooops... missed that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishypets Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Mike, If you are dosing two part why would you want to drip kalk too? By using two part your P.H. should never dip below 8 once you get it dialed in. I would only think that dosing kalk too might be a recipe for disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 Cause it came free with the right priced top off pump... I've always dripped Kalk, or added it to make up water, while using 2 part. My Ph was always stable around 8.4 and my Alk would generally be about 11-12 DKH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamp Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 I dose kalk with 2 part as well. I seem to have significantly better growth with both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishypets Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 So I'm confused on why you run kalk? I ran it through my top off water when I was using a CA reactor, this was to keep my P.H. somewhat stable. Even so I still had pretty big swings, from 8.3 to 7.6 at night. Now that I no longer use a reactor my P.H. only swings .2 from night to day. The thought of Kalk coming out of a 55 gallon barrel would scare me to death, especially coming out of a pump that's not a Tunze. Too much room for error there IMO. But hey if works for you so be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 Ok well now see, it doesn't work for me, yet. That's why I'm proposing all of my plans before putting them to action. I've never heard any complaints about running Kalk as your top off water. The amount that I am placing into the 55g barrel is very minimal compared with what some run in their Kalk reactors. Keep in mind that I'm only talking about 2 teaspoons per gallon(ish) and I'm not talking about a reactor that is putting super saturated Kalk into the tank. This is only what will actually mix into the water and in essence should not even separate to the bottom of the barrel. I haven't seen anyone else yet comment about why Kalk is not necessary or redundant, until then I guess I will still plan to run it. I figure I will get a new digital PH meter so that I can watch the PH much more closely, as I did in my old house, and make any adjustments as necessary. One thing that I noted in your last reply was that your PH fell, it did not climb as I would take the problem to be from dosing Kalk. I can't understand why dosing Kalk would cause it to fall. The stuff can come out at a PH of 12. Also since I run a 36w light over my fuge 24hours, I've never seen a swing in my PH from day to night. I've certainly heard of that issue from folks that don't run their fuge light 24 hours or don't run it opposite their display lights. Maybe I'm missing something from the last reply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishypets Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) I haven't seen anyone else yet comment about why Kalk is not necessary or redundant But it is redundant. One wouldn't run a calcium reactor plus add two part solutions now would one? Like I said before it's your tank do as you please but I don't see why you would want to do both. If you're worried about keeping your P.H. stable the two part solutions will do this for you, no problem. What really concerns me with your set up is the 55 gallon water storage top off tank. If one of the fail safes fail you dump a ton of fresh water in your tank (and on your floor) and lose everything. I would get a smaller 10 gallon can from the container store and use that instead. As far as my last tank goes I ran kalk to keep my P.H. from falling even lower. I think most people that run reactors plus kalk still have this problem to some degree. Edited October 28, 2009 by fishypets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 I hear what you are saying but I have multiple fail safes as stated above, not limited to a timer, an electronic on switch, an electronic overfill switch, and it is being pumped through a peristaltic pump that acts as it's own backflow device not allowing anything to pass when shut off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexKilpatrick Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 If you look on the two-part label, it does mention how to dose it if you are also doing kalk. I would suspect people do both because two-part is typically a once per day while kalk is throughout the day. But the fact that they mention it on the label means it isn't all that unusual. Most ATOs will only run for about 15 minutes, after which they will alarm and lock up. That prevents you from dumping a ton of water into your aquarium. I realize you are going the full DIY route, but the commercial ATOs are not very expensive. Worth it for the extra peace of mind, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 What really concerns me with your set up is the 55 gallon water storage top off tank. If one of the fail safes fail you dump a ton of fresh water in your tank (and on your floor) and lose everything. I would get a smaller 10 gallon can from the container store and use that instead. Even if every thing Mike has for fail safes fail and the pump runs non stop it would take 60+ hrs to drain the 55g barrel at 50 ml per min Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishypets Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 Even if every thing Mike has for fail safes fail and the pump runs non stop it would take 60+ hrs to drain the 55g barrel at 50 ml per min Well if you pay attention to Mike's other post he sometimes works 80+ hours straight, with no break. So it is doable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 29, 2009 Author Share Posted October 29, 2009 Oh those were the days weren't they? I'm going nuts with all this free time and to little pay to enjoy it.. It's always one or the other isn't it? Muddyblue, you figured out why I chose to use a very slow rate peristaltic pump for my top off. It would take a very long time for an "accident" to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I looked at the same pumps from BRS but went with the Aqua lifter. It pumps about 3x the rate of yours. I was not as concerned with over flowing my sump if their was a malfunction. I only have about 15g of top off water at the most and my sump should hold about 12 of that. I have about 3-4 gallons of evaporation per day and it would take about 4 hours to empty my top off so at worst I would have a gallon or 2 on the floor. I do have a second float as a back up if the first one fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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