+KimP Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I don't want to hijack Teresa's thread ( http://www.austinreefclub.com/topic/29522-this-is-what-i-want-now-how-do-i-make-it-happen/#entry226491 ) so I've started my own on basically the same subject. We just bought this house and placing a tank in this arch would be an awesome place to have a tank because you could see it from the entire downstairs. The length of the opening is about 49" so perfect for a 90g, but the wall would have to be built wider. In the picture, the wall that is 90 degrees to the one with the arch, if the ledge was built out to the end of that wall, it would be 19" which is also perfect for a 90g. In Teresa's thread, some of the quotes were in the 5k-7k range. What would all that be for? I'm looking for help figuring out a realistic quote before deciding to go ahead with the project. I'm assuming most of the project would be essentially building a regular tank stand, just as part of the wall, with the complication of moisture control. Seems really strait forward but I can't figure out what would cost thousands of dollars. What am I missing? Please help me pick apart this project before moving forward It would be a drilled tank with sump underneath with access on the tile side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsea Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Kim, It is straight forward. Get a quote from a finished carpenter that does custom work. Patrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsea Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Will your tank be open on top? With respect to moisture control in the cabinet, standard water resistant sealants should protect all wood surfaces. I see no reason to take any further steps. If you put small air movers with vents in cabinet space, you would increase evaporative cooling. I am thinking that with an open top tank and LED lighting you would have to heat the water already. Just a thought. Patrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victoly Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 IIRC, Theresa's thread was for the whole shebang, tank included. I would put 5k at the high end, not the low end. Maybe 500-1,000 for electrical pull if they put in a dedicated circuit (which you probably should considering your livestock) and then 1-2k for the stand/cabinetry. It might be worth investing in a metal stand so that you can have the feet wide enough to get a sump in or out if you have to. Maybe another couple hundred to wire your lights through the arch to keep the look clean? The final piece to consider would be how you intend to control temps. If you're going to evap you should probably dump that wet sump air (either vented inside your house or forced outside outside the sump so it doesn't stay trapped in your cabinet and ruin your apex). If you intend to run a chiller then you're going to have to do some additional homework. Of course the devil will be in the details that no one is thinking of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckyuv Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Beautiful house! The kitchen looks nice! I don't see you spending that much if your using the same tank and equipment! Really all your doing is a little sheet rock work on the arch to make it wider and cabinetry/stand at the base. I do think viewing it front to back tho you would have to look into a peninsula style tank since the back over flows would now be front center overflows on the other side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Like Victoly pointed out it depends on how much your doing yourself and how much you have a carpenter and electrician do for you. It's a remote possibility you might find a stand you could modify that would pretty much elimnate any actual modifications to to your existing wall. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mlaw Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 The main thing to keep in mind is access. I have a built in tank that came with our current house. I struggle with getting access. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 The main thing to keep in mind is access. I have a built in tank that came with our current house. I struggle with getting access. In what ways? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victoly Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 into the sump, i would imagine, and the ability to get to overflows, arms in the tank, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Biggest issue I've run into with tanks in walls is cleaning the front glass. Having cabinet doors above the tank in front lets you see what you are doing when you clean algae off the glass and set and move stuff around. This doesn't seem like as big an issue to me in your application as it seems to me easy enough to design something that looks goos and has doors on both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard L Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Cool location. If I understand your original post you're talking about a tank that will be 19" wide? I'm wondering if that will be wide enough to build up rock in the middle, place corals on both sides and still have swimming. With those wood floors you may want to consider building in a safety pan and definitely recommend a contoller with water leak sensors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Lots of good things to think about, thanks guys. Just to clarify, I was thinking of making the ledge wider and just plopping the tank on top, not enclosing the tank in any way. I would leave it open just as it is now with the light bar hanging from the arch like victoly mentioned. I can't see how my access to the tank would be less than it is now, with just my standard setup against the wall. I could even have a cabinet door on the backside for sump access on the back as well. I'd have to get a new 90gal with a corner overflow of course. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Cool location. If I understand your original post you're talking about a tank that will be 19" wide? I'm wondering if that will be wide enough to build up rock in the middle, place corals on both sides and still have swimming. With those wood floors you may want to consider building in a safety pan and definitely recommend a contoller with water leak sensors. Thanks, yes, just trying to keep it a standard tank size. I'd have to be clever with rock placement and keep a very open look. I'm super chicken about the wood floors :/ I did get the water sensors for the apex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mlaw Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 sorry I didn't give more detail yesterday. I was on my phone. Access is a huge issue for me in that my tank is fully inclosed in the wall. I really need to get some pictures up here but basically think of it like this, my tank is sitting on a stand and has had a big wooden box plopped on top and is now pushed up against one wall. The top of the box isn't high enough for me to climb in and over the tank and the bottom of the box comes up and cuts off my access to the sump. Basically if it is on the sides or front I can't reach it. If it goes into the tank and isn't up against the back glass it's gone for good. What you are talking about isn't really a tank in a wall per se. It's much better. Basically your stand is going to be part of the wall. Doesn't sound like you are trying to do the classic "aquarium in a frame on the wall" style that is such a problem. That means that the access issues you are going to have are going to be the normal ones you run into when you are setting up a tank that is visible from both sides. If your display is drilled you won't have plumbing issues and if get an electrician out to deal with power you should be good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsea Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Kim, You only want to do this one time. I would strongly consider getting a 2' wide tank to give you the view that you and your new house will grow to love. You might even consider 3' wide if you can spare the lost space in the room. Laissez la bonne temps roulee, Patrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Hard to get much better access than an open top. If you are getting a new tank you can specify a "Room divider" setup with the over flow centered on one end. How would it look if you got a tank 2' wide like Pat suggested and had it stick into the kitchen space 5" or 6"? If you get a carbide hole saw from a home improvement store you can drill holes in your rock and use PVC pipe to support it which would let you go pretty high and still be very stable so even with a 90 you would still have plenty of space around the aquascaping for maintenance. It also has the advantage over hydrolic cement of being redouable in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Hard to get much better access than an open top. If you are getting a new tank you can specify a "Room divider" setup with the over flow centered on one end. How would it look if you got a tank 2' wide like Pat suggested and had it stick into the kitchen space 5" or 6"? If you get a carbide hole saw from a home improvement store you can drill holes in your rock and use PVC pipe to support it which would let you go pretty high and still be very stable so even with a 90 you would still have plenty of space around the aquascaping for maintenance. It also has the advantage over hydrolic cement of being redouable in the future. This is doable, and a great idea. I hadn't thought of going wider on the kitchen side. It all comes down to cost, of course. It sounds like the next step is comparing prices for various tanks Also, I have an electrician at the house right now, so when I get over there I'll ask about the electrical work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarmerTy Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 I say go with the wider tank and extend into the kitchen. You got plenty of space to go that way without having the house feel tight... not that that is even possible at your new place! You're going to be at the new house for a long while I would imagine so might as well get the tank you want and that you could run awhile before feeling the itch to upgrade. With a room divider style tank, my preference would be a minimum of 24" wide just so you can have a sandbed showing on both sides and not have the live rock leaning against the glass. I like 30" ideally though. Looking forward to your new tank build thread! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teresa Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 That's a beautiful kitchen! I'm excited you are thinking of trying something similar. We can definitely share ideas and insight. In fact, I'm liking the room divider idea with peninsula style tank. We're going to be modifying our walls anyway - might as well consider all options. Congratulations on the new house and I wish you luck with the moving I started looking into examples for the peninsula style tank and found the photos in this thread really helpful for visualizing the build process: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1743394 (photos start showing on page 3) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planeden Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 i'm not sure if i am too late to the party, but i was just wondering about cutting the little section of wall between the pillars out completely and then building a stand rather than trying to do too much with that little existing section. you can skin it with sheet rock to match. add bits around the pillars, or whatever you want to do, to close it in. also, it has an electrical outlet right there, so you just move that into the pillar on the right, inside the stand, and you have power inside the stand and easy to get to. of course, i know nothing about the dedicated circuit for this (how to do it or what the advantage is). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvrEnuf Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Kim, I now see I was thinking wrong in the pics you sent me, in the pic in the original post all you are talking about is a custom stand. I wouldn't use the ledge itself, you don't want to go to move out and find water damage that now has to be delt with (at least I wouldn't). I would at least remove the painted pine board and save it for re0instalation at time of move out. As to the dedicated circut: this means that plug would have a dedicated minimum of 110 watts on it's on breaker; so, when the kid plugs in a hair dryer somewhere it doesn't afect the circut your tank is on. Personally I would change it over to a GFI outlet (so if it got wet it's smaller internal breaker trips rather than relying on the main breaker box- in other words much less risk of fire du to salt creep!) (just a little tip from the insurance world : if your saltwater tank is not plugged into a GFI outlet your insurance company can deny a claim of fire loss due to that plug...this can cost you MUCH more than the tank alone, and IMHO is worth the cost of the electrical work) Seems like so long as the tank is drilled in the bottom you have no issues and should be looking at < $500 for the labor in the stand, and since the kitchen is so close you could at least go to a GFI outlet for another $350-$500 depending on drywall work. The guy I gave you the number for can do all that at about that price or less. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsea Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 GFI could be a breaker or it could be the wall receptacle. It is no more trouble to put in a GFI than a standard receptacle. Cost about $10 each. Patrick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 Yes, I would definitely have a GFI outlet. I talked to the electrician that was here the other day and he said it'd be almost impossible to do a dedicated circuit without really tearing things up. The area the tank would sit is pretty much dead center of the house, under a second story.He'll be back in about a week and I'll have him see exactly what all is on that circuit. He sounded like there's no way a tank these days would need one with everything so energy efficient and with the leds, and in a newer house. I don't use a heater or chiller. Anyway, I don't know for certain that's correct but I hope so! I'm glad to hear some confirmation on this being a fairly simple and straightforward project. I'm still contemplating tank sizes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Pedretti Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Kim, It is straight forward. Get a quote from a finished carpenter that does custom work. Patrick Kim you should talk to Chris (cstang) he did a in wall for Niko and it turned out really nice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Pedretti Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Yes, I would definitely have a GFI outlet. I talked to the electrician that was here the other day and he said it'd be almost impossible to do a dedicated circuit without really tearing things up. The area the tank would sit is pretty much dead center of the house, under a second story.He'll be back in about a week and I'll have him see exactly what all is on that circuit. He sounded like there's no way a tank these days would need one with everything so energy efficient and with the leds, and in a newer house. I don't use a heater or chiller. Anyway, I don't know for certain that's correct but I hope so! I'm glad to hear some confirmation on this being a fairly simple and straightforward project. I'm still contemplating tank sizes. If it was me I would have the gfi on the breaker rather than the plug...just to have the entire circuit covered in case something wonky happens 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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