DSB or BB? Your thoughts.

[subsea]

Thanks for starting this post! I have never liked the look of a BB tank, completely based on the aesthetics. So for me it is sand, natural looking, in all my scuba, and snorkeling I have yet to see a "bare bottom" reef ... That being said, I do follow the "pros and cons" of a DSB and BB, given what I said, I'm going with sand.

Scutterborn comments do raise another questions that may be inline with that Chad's general questions are... If I don't do a DSB in my DT, but have say a 2 inch sand bed, am I going to cause issue? Scutterborn: "create a potential anoxic zones that can/will lead to H2S gas" Are there other things that one needs to do to maintain that bed?

I do plan on having a DSB in my refugium, the depth and size are still in the planning stage.

Here's all you could ever want to know about H2S in the reef

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-12/rhf/index.php#14

Very indepth article. Good science and documentation.

In my profession as a Senior Subsea Engineer, I attended seninars where we observed deep sea vents with massive amounts of biodiversity in over 5000' of water. At this depth in the GOM, the bottom is as flat as BB tank. These vents ejected tons of H2S in the Gulf waters. On drilling location with a dynamically positioned semisubmersible, we were required to monitor the worms 24/7. Remote operated vehicles with robots and cameras. Every now and again, I would visit with the Oceaneering boys in their space ship control center. If you scanned the bottom with sonor, there was nothing for five circular miles. Yet in the immediate area of these poisonous vents lived a complete ecosystem. One thing that I do know, we do not know everything. In fact, I will step out and say that with respect to the cosmos, I do not know much and I am willing to learn.

Patrick

[Chad and Belinda]

Thanks for the BB seminar.

In using the contoured PVC, have you considered how long it would take to be obscured with coraline. I do not cover my back glass with anything. Within less than 6 months, it is disguised and within one year it is covered up solid with coraline. This would allow the benefit without the danger of adhesives. It would also provide a quasi cryptic/refuge in the display tank in the faux bottom. No telling what might grow there. Possible reef food.

May good things go your way,

Patrick

We were going to use Marco rock in the tank. I figured the bottom and rocks would look fugly for awhile but should color up together. Guess I never considered the fact this may create a "quasi cryptic/refuge". That would be a nice suprise.

In regards to your post about your profession, now I know where "subsea" came from.

Thank to everyone for your input. There is a lot more to this subject than I had thought but I am excited to learn things I never knew or perhaps even considered.

[Chad and Belinda]

Thanks for starting this post! I have never liked the look of a BB tank, completely based on the aesthetics. So for me it is sand, natural looking, in all my scuba, and snorkeling I have yet to see a "bare bottom" reef ... That being said, I do follow the "pros and cons" of a DSB and BB, given what I said, I'm going with sand.

Scutterborn comments do raise another questions that may be inline with that Chad's general questions are... If I don't do a DSB in my DT, but have say a 2 inch sand bed, am I going to cause issue? Scutterborn: "create a potential anoxic zones that can/will lead to H2S gas" Are there other things that one needs to do to maintain that bed?

I do plan on having a DSB in my refugium, the depth and size are still in the planning stage.

Here's all you could ever want to know about H2S in the reef

http://reefkeeping.c...hf/index.php#14

Great information! Thanks

[Mark V]

What is the definition I a remote DSB. Is that just housing a DSB in your refugium or are you talking about a large tank hooked up to you display tank that is solely a DSB? For example if you have a 100 gallon tank is a remit DSB just having a DSB in your refugium area in say your 30 gallon sump or are you talking about setting up a 55 gallon tank and connecting it to the display and making the entire tank dedicated to being a DSB? How much denitratification or you getting either way?

[Scutterborn]

Remote would imply " other than your display tank". Regardless of where it is. The bigger the better. Mine will be in the sump right after the fuge section. If you choose to employ a separate tank for that, it would still be fine. Some people just don't have the room or it isn't aesthetically pleasing to have another tank viewable.

- Ben -

[subsea]

What is the definition I a remote DSB. Is that just housing a DSB in your refugium or are you talking about a large tank hooked up to you display tank that is solely a DSB? For example if you have a 100 gallon tank is a remit DSB just having a DSB in your refugium area in say your 30 gallon sump or are you talking about setting up a 55 gallon tank and connecting it to the display and making the entire tank dedicated to being a DSB? How much denitratification or you getting either way?

Mark,

All sceanarios that you discribed contain remote DSB. When Anthony Calfo proposed the concept on Marine Depot forum on animal husbandry, he had a different application. The best example of this was a fish store that had 10K gallons of marine displays. With large pricey fish moving thru to be sold, there was a serious ammonium and nitrate problem. Anthony set up a 55 gallon tank as a RDSB. With a 20" deep aquarium, he set up a 16" aroggonite sand bed with inlet and outlet at 1" above sand bed. With a shallow level above substrate, 20 GPM water will have a high velocity and carry detritus into the next container which was the settling basin for detritus. He used a 55 gallon drum with a bottom drain to decante out the nasties. Nitrate levels had never been below 100 ppm. Within one week, nitrates were below 10 ppm.

Patrick

[Mark V]

So in theory this would mean that people with predators could achieve denitratification that you would get in a reef tank. Sweet! How would you apply this in a home aquarium. Would you just use a 5 gallon bucket and create a 9 inch bed and run your inlet and outlet through it? Anyone set this up in the past?

[subsea]

So in theory this would mean that people with predators could achieve denitratification that you would get in a reef tank. Sweet! How would you apply this in a home aquarium. Would you just use a 5 gallon bucket and create a 9 inch bed and run your inlet and outlet through it? Anyone set this up in the past?

That is exactly what you do to build a utilitarian RDSB.

Patrick

[Sascha D.]

DSB and BB are two opposite extremes. People who have DSB are trying to mimic nature and people who have BB are trying to take nature out of the equation. We've all heard stories of how a DSB "ruined" someones tank in one way or another or how hard it is to remove if you ever have to remove it. People who have BB are either trying to avoid these problems or have experienced them. Typically when you see BB tanks they have few or no fish and focus on corals. Owners of BB tanks are more "in control" of the water parameters and more involved in maintenance, while DSB tanks tend to run themselves most of the time.

One great tip I can provide is if you go BB then make some pvp plugs to hold up your LR off the bottom glass. It makes them more stable and you can create a gap between the floor and the rocks. You can then direct some flow to the bottom and you won't get detrius settlement.

[Chad and Belinda]

DSB and BB are two opposite extremes. People who have DSB are trying to mimic nature and people who have BB are trying to take nature out of the equation. We've all heard stories of how a DSB "ruined" someones tank in one way or another or how hard it is to remove if you ever have to remove it. People who have BB are either trying to avoid these problems or have experienced them. Typically when you see BB tanks they have few or no fish and focus on corals. Owners of BB tanks are more "in control" of the water parameters and more involved in maintenance, while DSB tanks tend to run themselves most of the time.

One great tip I can provide is if you go BB then make some pvp plugs to hold up your LR off the bottom glass. It makes them more stable and you can create a gap between the floor and the rocks. You can then direct some flow to the bottom and you won't get detrius settlement.

That's a great idea!!

Thanks for the information.

[subsea]

DSB and BB are two opposite extremes. People who have DSB are trying to mimic nature and people who have BB are trying to take nature out of the equation. We've all heard stories of how a DSB "ruined" someones tank in one way or another or how hard it is to remove if you ever have to remove it. People who have BB are either trying to avoid these problems or have experienced them. Typically when you see BB tanks they have few or no fish and focus on corals. Owners of BB tanks are more "in control" of the water parameters and more involved in maintenance, while DSB tanks tend to run themselves most of the time.

One great tip I can provide is if you go BB then make some pvp plugs to hold up your LR off the bottom glass. It makes them more stable and you can create a gap between the floor and the rocks. You can then direct some flow to the bottom and you won't get detrius settlement.

Outstanding summation of the discussion involving opposing methods to produce acceptable results. Patrick